Interview with Sandro Boeri, Managing Director Training Date: 17/05/2010  Author: New City Agora

Sandro Boeri is the co-founder of Risk Audit, a successful business venture leader dealing with the recruitment and  professional development of internal auditors.

I met with him in his office in Fenchurch Avenue, and begun by asking him to tell me something about  himself.

Sandro:- I first entered the City in my early twenties. I started by working at Kleinwort Benson. My own background in that context was interesting as a son of Italians emigrated in the late fifties. My mother was a waitress, my father a shoemaker. He actually made shoes  for the famous, like the Rolling Stones, Liza Minnelli, all people  I hadn’t heard of at the time. The irony is that people now tell me I am getting old when I mention these same names.

What is amusing is that my father used to ask me “what do you do for a living?” and I was replying, “I advise banks  on how to run  their operations”, and he used to respond  ”What qualifies you to do that? Have you ever run a bank…?”.

He recently asked me the same questions just a few weeks ago “Are you still advising banks on how to run themselves?” to  which I decided not to reply. The less said the better!

Kleinwort Benson, was a universal bank, and I had the opportunity to travel to some 42 countries.

Eventually I moved on in the world of internal audit.

I worked for 3 years for the Japanese and I have to say that the glass ceiling still exists albeit probably less now.

I worked for the Dutch, for what became ABN AMRO.

I worked for Credit Agricole.

I eventually came to the conclusion that it was time to influence the market in a different way.

This is how the idea for Risk Audit came about - it was 1999.

Risk Audit was initially born to provide a different type of recruitment service.

When looking for a new job I have often saw my CV sent to the wrong people, or ended up talking to recruiters who didn’t really understand what I did for a living.

In my role as Head of Internal Audit I used to spend time interviewing people who were just wasting my time because recruitment agents had misrepresented their details to me.

I  understood there was the need for somebody who really understood what Internal audit does, able to understand the various roles in internal audit, somebody with some form of emotional understanding of what an internal auditor feels when he or sheis looking for work.

This is the key to Risk Audit, our mantra: treat people the way we would we would like to be treated. This is at the core of all we do, all our business, including  our training business.

The training service was really an afterthought. In 2001 we saw the events of the twin towers unfold before our eyes  and Mitchell Ross (my usiness partner who now runs the recruitment arm of Risk Audit) and myself  decided we couldn’t continue just as a one product company, as a recruitment agency in investment banking, a sector that was likely to be hit hard.

Our first training course  was run in Christmas 2001 – “Compliance for Internal Auditors”

We were able to run 4-5 courses within 3 months and realized we had something.

We developed a portfolio of courses in focused on products / themes with a link to business risks and key controls..

What we have now is quite unique.

The business has growen from there.

There are pros and cons in having two lines of business like ours  - that is recruitment and training.

Central to Risk Audit value system is the importance of developing  strong relationships with our clients.

With our services not only do we provide candidates but we also help train the audit team. This is a unique combination that far outweighs a minor conflict of interest. To manage this we are very strict in our process and we do not head hunt from training clients.

NCA:- Where does the name Risk Audit come from?

Sandro:-When we set the company up we wanted the flexibility to extend our business to the world of risk management whilst retaining a major presence in the audit community. Hence the name – Risk Audit.

I would like to pretend that the name originated as a result of a major branding initiative that would be telling a lie.

NCA:- What was the biggest challenge you faced?

Sandro:- What was very difficult is that for the first three months of Risk Audit’s life was the fact that we were taking risks with our own money and risking our own mortgages.

Every single fee made a big difference.

The first 6 months were an enormous challenge as we were in the unknown.

That said, we always kept a positive attitude.

NCA:- What is your most valuable asset or skill?

Sandro:-I have always been an Auditor Entrepreneur, as I have always run the audit department as an entrepreneur.

I have always wanted to make a difference in terms of persuading people to act – this is an integral part of my  working process.

The skill set I am using now is extremely similar to what I used as an internal auditor.

Then I was dealing with internal clients, now the clients are external.

At the core of this process, is a desire to understand what makes people tick and reacting to their perception of the world.

NCA:- What’s your vision now? Has it changed from the original?

Sandro:-The vision hasn’t changed.

There are two major elements to it.

The business element is to run a company active in London, the UK, Far East and United States.

Active in recruitment and professional development, mainly in corporate governance, internal audit, compliance and risk management.

The vision is to build a business to the size of 25 staff, as well as forging a series of alliances with a variety of trainers, speakers and course  facilitators around the world.

Then there is the emotional vision which is to interact with people in a way that treats them in the manner I would like to be treated.

This was and continues to be our vision.

NCA:- How is the current market affecting your vision?

Sandro:-We have just hired new recruitment staff, as we believe this is a time of opportunity.

We are also seeking to launch a range of distance learning initiatives we whould address our clients budgetary constraints and take advantage of the internet as a means of effective communication.

Yes, yes the credit crunch will slow us down, but our vision is the same.

NCA:- Is the credit crunch your biggest challenge?

Sandro:-No, not necessarily.

A bigger challenge I had to make in transitioning from an employed internal auditor to a self-employed recruiter.

This successful transition gives me confidence for the future.

NCA:- Where do you see Risk Audit in three years time?

Sandro:- First answer is “alive and kicking”.

Then growing on the back of established foundations.

I see a Risk Audit with important things to say, ideas, a forward looking company with a positive message.

One of the things we are doing is to forge strong relationships with people who are currently losing their jobs.  I hope that we will be in a position to help them soon. I also hope that they will be in a position to help us later as we work towards our vision.

I suppose it is a case of “you scratch my back and I will scratch yours”.

NCA:- Can you expand on the need for a positive message?

Sandro:- It goes back to internal audit whose core product is the delivery of criticism.

You can deliver criticism in a destructive fashion with the  effect of de-moralising people and undermining action. Or you can deliver it as an opportunity to learn and change, thus making it easier to reach an agreement on what needs  to be changed.

It is a completely different approach as it believes in a positive future.

NCA:- Do you think there is too much negativity now?

Sandro:-I do believe that the financial services sector needs to reduce over-leverage and deal with a bloated cost base. The process of achieving this will certainly create negative feelings.

That said, people and companies need financial intermediation which is the key services provided by all types of financial institutions.

For this reason, I am confident that I sector will grow again but hopefully this time with a better set of applied corporate goveranance philosophies.

NCA:- What do you think are the key steps to get us out of this crisis?

Sandro:-I can’t help but look at the South Africa experience and the end of apartheid.

We need a truth committee of some sort.

This needs to be apolitical. I also believe we need maximum transparency on the status of banks’ balance sheets.

We need to remove question marks about who is solvent and who isn’t.

And then we can move forward.

NCA:- What are the skills of a successful entrepreneur?

Sandro:- A good entrepreneur needs risk management skills.

He/she doesn’t gamble and always considers the downside and makes  sure that it doesn’t destroy the business.

A good entrepreneur needs to be able to sell, especially in a small business. He/she needs to persuade other people to buy ideas and products.

Also he/she needs a good degree of emotional intelligence.

I begun to develop this over the last few years, asking myself what do people feel, how they react to my interaction with them.

Empathy is essential. You need to be able to see people’s perspective through their eyes.

NCA:- Can you expand on your initiative to create a Support group?

Sandro:- It is still very much a work in progress. There are a number of initiatives that we are taking for those people who have lost their jobs.

I know from personal experience what people feel when they lose their jobs as I was made redundant from Credit Agricole. “ Redundant” is a negative word.

Our mantra is “Treat people the way you would liketo be treated”.

We now offer a number of places for free on our training courses to people  who have been made redundant.

In our recruitment business we have an elaborate process to deal with the ever growing army of people who have lost theor jobs.

Our communication style aims to focus on the positive, without hiding the ffundamental facts.

In the next few weeks we will put together some tangible venues that we see the first meeting of a support group we are sponsoring.

There is a commercial angle: we would like people to remember us when they are in a better position.

NCA:- What are your thoughts on the current economic scenario?

Sandro:-Every week continues to surprise me with new ways of conjuring up bad news. I can’t even begin to answer the question.

All I know is that eventually the governments will come together and coordinate, and there will be a high degree  of  transparency.

The key factor will be when the US property market stabilises.

When?

I haven’t got a clue.

Soon would be nice.

NCA:- Any advice for graduates wanting to work in the City?

Sandro:- They need to ask themselves: why they want to work in the City. If it’s just for money, then I would suspect it’s better to  look for alternative employment.

If they want to engage in a stimulating pastime there is plenty of stimulation to be had.

Quantitative risk modeling is not dead, but it will undergo a redesign.

Innovative finacial engineering is not dead: providing that it is done transparently securitisation will come back as it is a  very good way of managing risk.

Ultimately we have a major rebuilding exercise in the banking industry and this can be very stimulating.

Earning an above average salary in a major industry undergoing renewal should prove a great challenge for many graduates.

NCA:- Sandro I want to thank you very much for your time

Go Back